Sorry for the benefit of this post (and others who may read it) ... I want to chime in on this 1 thing:

I prefer to believe that they are doing a great job and making a fortune from clickbank.
Ian, I do apologize if what you got out of any of my posts was some sort of naysayer nonsense like "it can't be done", "everyone is lying" etc. That is definitely NOT the case.

But... to further talk about numbers.

Often during a launch for a product that has recurring billing, the reported figures will include a 12-month forecasted sales figure. Meaning if your recurring is $97 and you sell 1000 copies ... that's $100,000 per month. It's not uncommon to have that be reported as a $1.2 million dollar launch.

THAT is reality. Not naysayer or negative. I just happen to have friends in various verticals and we have late night skype conversations, private facebook messages about the real NET REVENUES. Not to mention, I've seen true gross vs true net figures in promotions where I was equity partner and even the ones I launched.

Gross figures and the typical marketing-spin can really make numbers deceptive if you don't know how to interpret them.

Again though, to feed the point of the post I just made before this one... technically reporting a $100,000 month as a $1.2 million dollar launch isn't "lying". It's just plain old marketing. Because they simply spotlight the forecasted number versus the actual revenue.

In addition, on CB products refunds are particularlly high in the marketer-savvy verticals such as forex (where refund rates are typically 30%+) and the IM space where refunds rates are 15-20%. That's not my theory. Ask anyone who has sold at least a couple of hundred units in those markets and see if they don't agree. In many cases, it's 25% refunds simply because too many in the CB world know how to cheat the system.

Furthermore, CB keeps roughly $8 of every $97 purchase (as an example). That's from their 7.5% fees + $1 flat. That's roughly $8.50 if the sale was $97. Well that means 8.5% of the sales are also eaten up.

And, as you probably will note, many CB launches are setup to raise gravity and visibility for the long term benefits. So during launch weeks, affiliates are paid often 60% - 75% commissions of their sales.

And I went to check the 2 examples you referenced, they currently show 60% and 70% commissions respectively. So let's use 65% as the average.

So... let me just plant a seed. Something that can maybe just help anyone reading this consider the full picture.

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Suppose I wanted to go big on a CB launch.

I'd build the product, pages, graphics, pre-launch etc.

I'd invest at least 2 months into this process and probably about $10,000 (when you factor in teaser videos, salescopy, graphics, virtual assistants and more). Not to mention, over those 2 months I've focused on pretty much only this project so there is an "opportunity" lost cost of money that I could have made elsewhere.

So far... into my big launch... I'm 2 months invested and $10,000 down. (Those are conservative and very fair numbers).

If I want to go BIG and I'm SMART... then what I care about is the long term exposure I get in the marketplace. The higher my gravity and the more units sold, the more likely that other CB affiliates will find my offer and promote it for me in the long term... long after the launch buzz is gone.

Launch day comes.

After all is said and done, I have 2000 sales at $97 each. For simplicity, let's call that $200,000 revenue.

Since I want to build confidence in my affiliates, I'll likely use the projected figure of $200k x 12 months = $2.4 million dollar launch. (StomperNet boys did precisely this and so do many others. It's just common practice).

But, in reality, I only had $200,000 come in so far.

Now...

It cost me 65% that I'm paying out to affiliates.

So my aff payouts are : $130,000

Clickbank keeps their 8.5%.

So I lose: $17,000

The whole thing cost me at least $10,000

Oh and I'll definitely see at least 15% refund rate.

So from clawbacks/refunds, I'll lose $30,000 (though the affiliates also don't receive commissions on this, of course).

Just even adding up the percents of what I lose ... that's 65% to affiliates, 8.5% to CB = 73.5% of my gross revenue I never see and, 15% of my total sales I'll never see. And that's real numbers. By no means "alarmist" or negative nonsense. Just legit math.).

In this very real-to-life scenario, my $200,000 in revenues for my AT LEAST 2 months of work and effort pays out like this...

$200,000 x 15% full refunds = $30,000
$170,000 x 73.5% that I never see (due to aff comms and CB fees) = $124,950

So ...

$170,000 - $124,950 = $45,050 actual pay day.

Since I didn't work on much else during my 2 months building this, it's only fair to properly count that net as $22,525 per month for all my efforts. (And I won't calculate it further but you'll find a lot of the launches are a partnership between 2 marketers which means you need to split that even further to a net of roughly $11k per month per person).

** Again, I don't want to kill your dreams nor suggest that there isn't big money being made, but everything I stated is real. the 65% affiliate commissions is real (many launches even pay 75%); the 8.5% you lose to CB as a merchant is very real; the 15% refund rate is much too real (in fact, many merchant will tell you 25% can be expected). And there IS a time-cost and "opportunity lost" cost associated with every launch.



Let me paint a picture using a very big name marketer who I know very well. I won't name him and it's irrelevant either way but I just want to have you (the reader) consider the real numbers.

He built a promotion across 8 months. It wasn't full time especially on his part, but it did take up 8 months worth of part-time focus.

His outsourcing bill (various pro videos, tech work, salescopy, teaser content development) was $100,000.

He had a lot of muscle behind it and they launched and sold $600,000. That is NOT the typical "12-month forecast" numbers. That's actual $600k revenue.

However, he was paying 60%.

I don't know his refunds rates but based on the price point, it was at least 5%. Probably 15%+ but let's use 5%.

I won't even factor merchant fees etc.

But his real numbers were:

$600,000 x 5% refunds = $570,000 gross
$570,000 x 60% aff comms leaves him with = $228,000
(again I'm being very conservative with refunds and haven't even factored merchant fees etc).
From $228,000 he invested $100,000 to put it together.
So his payday, after 8 months of work is $128,000

Not bad at all... but the above was a BIG success. Not record breaking mind you. But that $128,000 NET payday was from a VERY successful promotion.

So always consider how the numbers REALLY unfold for the lesser promotions.